Podcast EP 129 | How to Identify A-Players During an Interview

There is no sub­sti­tute for A‑Players.​The high­er the per­cent­age of A‑Players on your teams, and the longer you keep them, the greater the chance of suc­cess. But how do you know when you’ve got a poten­tial A‑Player on your hands?

​This week Brad Giles and Kevin Lawrence dis­cuss the four things you must know to iden­ti­fy A‑Players dur­ing an inter­view — and how to rein­force their poten­tial after that.

EPISODE TRAN­SCRIPT

Please note that this episode was tran­scribed using an AI appli­ca­tion and may not be 100% gram­mat­i­cal­ly cor­rect – but it will still allow you to scan the episode for key content.

Brad Giles 00:13

Hi there, and wel­come to the Growth Whis­per­ers where every­thing we talk about is build­ing endur­ing great com­pa­nies. My name is Brad Giles. And today as always, I’m joined by my co host, Kevin Lawrence. Hel­lo, Kevin. How are things?

Kevin Lawrence 00:25

Things are great. Com­ing into win­ter things. Life’s good.

Brad Giles 00:29

Good to hear. Good to hear. We’ve got an inter­est­ing top­ic today we’re talk­ing about how to iden­ti­fy A play­ers dur­ing an inter­view. Some­thing that’s pret­ty time­ly at the moment.

Kevin Lawrence 00:41

We’ve got some great sto­ries of what hap­pens when you don’t.

Brad Giles 00:49

We’d like to start with a word or phrase of the day. Kev, what might you have today?

Kevin Lawrence 00:54

Com­pe­ti­tion. Oh, I just over the week­end. And I’ve shared before but my pas­sion for rac­ing and final­ly back into full blown com­pe­ti­tion. Two races on the week­end. First time in a long time. And I got to get back to there’s one thing dri­ving a race car and learn­ing how to dri­ve it and mas­ter­ing on a race track. And it’s anoth­er thing to com­pete on a big road, we do road cours­es like you would see for f1. This track and just the thrill of the bat­tle, it’s kind of it’s the feel­ing kind of like, must have been like for cave­men. And cave women out there hunt­ing, try­ing to get din­ner, just the amount of adren­a­line pump­ing through your sys­tem. And we have an amaz­ing group of guys in this race group that were part of and when I was like 16, or 17, in less than a week, and it was just amaz­ing. And I for­got how much I loved it. And so com­pe­ti­tion and that thrill of the chal­lenge and the chase, and and the high stakes and great peo­ple I was so that’s my competition.

Brad Giles 02:07

Yeah, mine is a bit the oppo­site to that. Mine is mine is a word which is onboard­ed. So last week, I got the first phys­i­cal copy of my new book Onboard­ed, which for those ratio­nal­iza­tions, thank you those on YouTube, you can see just there. And that’s due out on the first of Novem­ber, that’s the release date. The onboard­ing, how to bring new hires to the point where there they are effec­tive, faster, so that hav­ing got that first phys­i­cal copy, it’s a great mile­stone could­n’t go past that as a word of the day. So let’s say you stitch those together.

Kevin Lawrence 02:46

Not a chance. What I will say what I will say is, you know, and for those who have read, ear­ly work, the brad did on his onboard book, he put a lot of thought into mas­ter­ing that part of the hir­ing a per­son. So I know there are a lot of great insights in it. And it’s damn impor­tant. Yeah, you know, if you don’t onboard peo­ple prop­er­ly, a lot of stuff gets missed, decreas­es your chances of suc­cess. I’m sure what I was telling my team about it tonight, Brad and our team meet­ing. I showed them the book and told them all about it and told them be a great resource for all of our clients.

Brad Giles 03:24

So sweet. So we’re hav­ing to do a lit­tle bit of work on that in the lead up to that book launch. Maybe a few sub­jects to talk about. But today we’re talk­ing about, you know, what we got, we got a ques­tion from a lis­ten­er, which we loved. Did­n’t we love that? So it’s from David, from Vir­ginia in the USA from a com­pa­ny called Merid­i­an bird removal. had a look at their web­site. What an awe­some busi­ness. So yeah, a great busi­ness merid­i­an, bird removal. They all across the US and they that if you need to get rid of birds, they’re the peo­ple to talk to. So this is this is Dav­e’s ques­tion. For con­text, I’m won­der­ing about spot­ting tal­ent, there’s a train­ing oppor­tu­ni­ty for hir­ing man­agers, a play­er’s and not ter­ri­bly com­mon, how to attract young pro­fes­sion­als who have this pro­file, also how to help hir­ing man­agers pierce the veil of the 60 to 90 minute inter­view to see who pos­sess­es the char­ac­ter dri­ve and poten­tial to be tru­ly excep­tion­al and who does­n’t. His­tor­i­cal­ly, we’ve not empha­sized this near­ly enough, we don’t nec­es­sar­i­ly under­stand it well enough to be able to empha­size that we’ve relied on tra­di­tion­al HR process­es which are pret­ty good for core val­ues and core cul­tur­al align­ment that fall short of help­ing us accu­rate­ly iden­ti­fy true a pli­ers. Thank you for your con­sid­er­a­tion on this top­ic. So, thank you, Dave, if any­one else has ques­tions, we love ques­tions, it gives us some great top­ics to dis­cuss. So please send those through. So Kev, how to iden­ti­fy A play­ers dur­ing an inter­view? This is how we’ve inter­pret­ed that ques­tion for sure.

Kevin Lawrence 05:22

We know it’s there, it’s hard to find them. And, you know, the real­i­ty is there’s tools where peo­ple go wrong is first of all, let’s define a play­er’s in our world that we as a play­er is some­one who would score an A, just like in the old report card sys­tem in school, an A on cul­ture fit, being con­sis­tent on har­mo­nious and the cul­ture of your com­pa­ny, liv­ing your core val­ues and aligned to your pur­pose. And an A on per­for­mance in Cana­da, you know, in a starts at 85%, I think in the US, it’s 90. So it’s a very, like very good on cul­ture fit and very good on per­for­mance. That’s the per­son we’re look­ing for. And you know, and most com­pa­nies have 25 to 30% of these awe­some humans, that kind of make up the top 10% of peo­ple avail­able, what­ev­er it is, you’re going to pay for that job. And, you know, we we push to get com­pa­nies a lot high­er, because you know, the bet­ter your team, the bet­ter at work. So, so that’s kind of set in a table for it. But find­ing these peo­ple, it’s tough, we use tools, like that’s, and you know, there’s all kinds of tools out there, and voodoo hir­ing tech­niques and all kinds of fun stuff. What we gen­er­al­ly look for is one, know­ing what a per­for­mance is, and be, let’s see if the per­son match­es what we need. But just it’s being just super thor­ough when most peo­ple are in a super hur­ry when they’re try­ing to hire and that’s our par­ty. And we asked her about the 60s 90 min­utes. And as you and I know, 60 to 90 min­utes is a good start for an inter­view. But it’s not gonna get you there. So a lot of it requires chang­ing your per­spec­tive and tru­ly, invest­ing a bit more ener­gy upfront. So you have less headache on the back?

Brad Giles 07:19

Yeah, yeah. There’s no sub­sti­tute for a team of A play­ers. Yes­ter­day, I did a quar­ter­ly plan­ning work­shop with a team, they’ve bonafide got 90% A play­ers and I’ve had it for three or four years. And it’s just a fan­tas­tic envi­ron­ment pro­duc­ing great momen­tum. There’s no sub­sti­tute for that. Right? The high­er the per­cent­age of a play­er’s for longer, the greater the chance of the team’s suc­cess. So how do you know if you’ve got an A play­er or an A poten­tial on your hands, it real­ly comes back to what you said, which is, you’ve got to know, you’ve got to know what is suc­cess look like in the role? And often times, we kind of know we’re hir­ing for some­body, we know what the title is. But do we real­ly actu­al­ly under­stand what suc­cess means in that role?

Kevin Lawrence 08:14

Yeah, so I was talk­ing to at the race­track on the week­end talk­ing to a guy who is an X‑Games ath­lete, and start­ed his own con­struc­tion com­pa­ny, we got talk­ing about busi­ness and he’s get­ting going and I just kind of explained it to him. Pret­ty, straight­for­ward is that, you know, if you’re gonna go and build a win­ning hock­ey team, where you can kind of go and grab peo­ple at the local rec cen­ter and grab who you can get, and you’ll have some fun and play. But if you want to win that we call in Cana­da, the Stan­ley Cup, which is the top ward for the top teams in the Nation­al Hock­ey League, you’re going to need dif­fer­ent strate­gies and dif­fer­ent approach­es. And it’s not rock­et sci­ence. And I was just share with him when he was kind of a young entre­pre­neur and his part­ner is some­body that I know from the race­track as well. We’re talk­ing it’s not rock­et sci­ence. It’s just stay­ing focused on the this is a tal­ent game. And you got to approach it with a tal­ent mind­set. And I said for him, it’s like for him and his back­ground as an ath­lete is the same thing. When you’re look­ing for top ath­letes, we nat­u­ral­ly have this kind of mind­set. And we put the ener­gy in the time into it seems to be more hir­ing human beings in the busi­ness we don’t give that same lev­el of scruti­ny, but we nat­u­ral­ly would do it. If we owned NHL hock­ey team, we would nat­u­ral­ly do it if we’re build­ing a team of you know, freestyle motocrossers. And yeah, but but but we often fail to think that way and as a result, we end up with a lot of headaches and also hurt peo­ple by putting them in jobs. They could nev­er ever be suc­cess­ful. That’s the part that I’m just like, take these awe­some loy­al peo­ple, and we destroy them and stress them out by putting roles that they’re not ever they’re not suit­ed for at least at this point in time. And some­times maybe never. 

Brad Giles 10:07

The chal­lenge here is that a play­ers are hard to find, okay. Man­agers often aren’t also skilled in recruit­ing in how to find the right peo­ple. Yes. So, they might have done a bit of it, but we say go and do an inter­view, because I’m too busy man­ag­er, don’t do an inter­view, and see how you go. And then we just say, if you’re, if you’re own­ing the role, then you need to inter­view peo­ple your­self, but they might not real­ly know what that is. And they might not know what suc­cess looks like in the role.

Kevin Lawrence 10:37

Yes, and that’s the key piece. So, you know, exam­ple we hired a head of mar­ket­ing for a com­pa­ny that I work with. And this per­son was skilled, had amaz­ing expe­ri­ences, all this stuff. Unfor­tu­nate­ly, in mar­ket­ing, there’s two very dis­tinct branch­es of mar­ket­ing. Yeah, there’s brand, which is the big pic­ture look and feel of an old­er one feels about a com­pa­ny. And then there’s lead gen­er­a­tion, they’re dra­mat­i­cal­ly dra­mat­i­cal­ly dif­fer­ent ones kind of, like if it was cars, like one’s like a lux­u­ry car, and the oth­er is kind of like a truck for haul­ing grav­el, you know, they’re very, very dif­fer­ent. And if you’re going to buy a lux­u­ry car, a good trav­el could trav­el truck isn’t going to do. So they hired a brand per­son, in a com­pa­ny that does a tiny bit of brand, and almost all lead gen­er­a­tion, like direct response mar­ket­ing. I like the per­son try, but they could­n’t, they could­n’t have one. It’s it’s not. It’s not fair to the per­son, obvi­ous­ly, it’s hard for the com­pa­ny. But because they weren’t clear enough on what the job was, they were just hir­ing a direc­tor of mar­ket­ing. But they hired the wrong kind. So of course, the per­son could­n’t suc­ceed, it was­n’t good for them was­n’t good for the com­pa­ny. And it’s just like, so the up front, and I call it the engi­neers a spec for the job. Like, if we’re going to build a bridge, we’re gonna get the, we could draw a lit­tle draw­ing, or we can get the engi­neers to do the prop­er draw­ings of the prop­er mate­ri­als and the prop­er every­thing. And then when some­one goes to build it, they’ll build the right kind of bridge. But if you don’t have prop­er engi­neer draw­ings, you just send some peo­ple to go build a bridge, you’re ask­ing for trou­ble. So the engi­neers draw­ing up front is like, quadru­ple ly impor­tant. And it’s where a lot of hir­ing process­es fall apart.

Brad Giles 12:44

Yeah, yeah. See, what we can have is what I call can­di­date lust. And this is in a com­plete­ly pro­fes­sion­al way. Let me just flag that up. Right? Because the man­ag­er goes into the inter­view. And they’re like, they look at what the per­son is doing. The capa­bil­i­ties of that indi­vid­ual, they get to the point of the inter­view, and like, we’ve just got to get this per­son, let’s just get him my life is going to be so much eas­i­er. And that speaks to a big­ger prob­lem. Because I they’re going to sim­ply try to get that per­son on board and not fol­low a process. But what they’re doing is they’re look­ing at hir­ing as the be all and end all they’re look­ing at hir­ing as a deal. Imag­ine that you walked into a car lot, and you’re look­ing at a car, and you’re like, Oh, I love this Lexus this Lexus. You’re get­ting like car last right? I love this Lexus. I real­ly want to get it. And what does the sales­per­son say when you walk up and you’re enam­ored with the car. He says to him­self, this is all house her. So this is the best. This is the best sit­u­a­tion that I can hope for. Take it for a dri­ve, we’re going to say to you at the full stick­er price. But instead of that, what we want to do when it comes to hir­ing is we want to think about it as hir­ing. It’s not the deal is done when we sign the employ­ment con­tract. That is only the begin­ning of us val­i­dat­ing whether or not we have an A play­er. There are three major steps three major steps that we’ve got to think about. The first is the roll score­card. Okay, so this is how do we define suc­cess in the role? So for David, who sent us in this ques­tion, first of all, are the do the man­agers real­ly, real­ly clear­ly under­stand what suc­cess looks like in this role? To the point where it’s not pos­si­ble for them to mis­un­der­stand when they’re look­ing at can­di­dates they know exact­ly what it is. So, first of all, is that that is the whole hir­ing process from go to whoa adver­tise­ment to sign­ing the con­tract. Right. And then after that we’ve got an onboard­ing process, which typ­i­cal­ly might be about 90 days. And at the end of that hir­ing part of the onboard­ing process, we take some­one who is a poten­tial fit from the hir­ing process. And we’re able to define, Is this per­son a suc­cess­ful or not a suc­cess­ful fit?

Kevin Lawrence 15:22

The def­i­n­i­tion that engi­neers spec for the job that for our clients that we do this, we just had one of our clients doing it for Pres­i­dent role. We used, we worked with the top grad­ing group and Christ­mas saw that we do a lot of work with, he helped to define this role for one of our clients. And so we den­si­fy, the prod the pres­i­dent role, I worked with my client as well, just to dou­ble check some of the stuff that’s a four or five page, thor­ough doc­u­ment with a lot of data, and mea­sur­able things that are required for some­one to be suc­cess­ful in that role. Inter­est­ing what the CEO said, Hey, now that I got those done, I’ve met three peo­ple. I got; I liked them all. And then I went back and read the score­card, I think, come down to one. Because he because he The role was so clear­ly spec­i­fied, he could com­pare his ini­tial con­ver­sa­tions with the per­son against that score­card, and have a very good opin­ion, or at least a fil­ter of the ones who weren’t a fit, there’s still a deep­er process to go through for the ones that could be. So that def­i­n­i­tion is crit­i­cal. Peo­ple slip on that, then obvi­ous­ly, the assess­ment and that’s the thor­ough inter­view­ing por­tion, doing some assess­ments, doing some test­ing of skills for cer­tain jobs, like if they’re gonna be a writer, set them down, let them do some writ­ing. If they’re gonna be accoun­tant, set them down on licks, let them fix an income state­ment. Like some you know, this. And then for sure, speak­ing to Ref­er­ences, we had one hor­ri­ble hire who was a very nice per­son, but they just made a mess. Final­ly, we’re in the meet­ing. And I asked the CEO, I said, Well, did some­body check the ref­er­ences? He’s like, he calls HR. Nope, he goes, he steps out the CEO steps out, goes and starts mak­ing calls to con­firm the ref­er­ences. He got a hold of, I think he actu­al­ly he called the exec­u­tive was­n’t avail­able. He called asked for the CEO, spoke to the CEO, asked a few ques­tions said, thank you very much walks back in the room and says, the per­son­’s leav­ing tomor­row. Because and there’s a How the hell they came into our com­pa­ny, I don’t know, I spoke to the CEO of the com­pa­ny they came from, they said that they explained all the issues they had had, and it’s the iden­ti­cal issues we’re hav­ing. You know, it’s just it’s just, it’s, it’s, but that’s, that’s a tight process of eval­u­at­ing. So it’s like, it’s like, if you’re buy­ing a used car, get a darn inspec­tion, to make sure it’s not going to fall apart when you dri­ve off the lot. And if you you know, this is that’s dis­ci­pline. And peo­ple just often don’t have that rig­or. And then you get to the point of, if you do that, right, now you could onboard well, and unfor­tu­nate­ly, some­times peo­ple do all of that. Right. They onboard poor­ly, and then it falls apart too.

Brad Giles 18:26

I think I think it depends on the role. So for our lis­ten­er, David, he’s he might be hir­ing for some­one who isn’t an exec­u­tive. And that’s, that’s fine. So a full on, on a full on top grad­ing part of me a full on top grad­ing process may not be appro­pri­ate in that sce­nario, but he’s going to have a rig­or­ous hir­ing process num­ber one, again, that does check ref­er­ences 100%. It starts with a job score­card. The point that you made ear­li­er, Kev, was that dur­ing the hir­ing process, you refer back to the job score­card to know whether or not we’ve got the right per­son. Well, that’s why the job score­card comes at the begin­ning, not after­wards, so that we can avoid that can­di­date lost so that we’re not adapt­ing it to suit the peo­ple that we’re look­ing at. Then we go, this is what suc­cess looks like, then we’ve got to have a rig­or­ous hir­ing and then we’re going to have a rig­or­ous vet­ting and onboard­ing process to make sure that 90 days after we’ve signed a con­tract, we know, we know exact­ly whether or not this per­son is suc­cess­ful fit in the orga­ni­za­tion, or they should exit.

Kevin Lawrence 19:41

Exact­ly. And that’s and that’s the thing at the 90 day point, and espe­cial­ly, again, we’re kind of get­ting past the hir­ing piece. But you know, basi­cal­ly, if you have a less than per­fect hir­ing process, if you get 90% A play­ers com­ing in and you onboard them well, you’re gonna Have at least you know, at least 90%. At the end of that 90 days, if your hir­ing process is weak, well, then you’re gonna, at the end of the 90 days have a lit­tle bit more deci­sion, more deci­sions to make about the peo­ple who aren’t mak­ing it. And that’s what’s crit­i­cal. But the key is to be able to make that deci­sion that 90 days, so they’re not get­ting too embed­ded in your com­pa­ny, build­ing rela­tion­ships with peo­ple and, and get­ting entrenched if the if they’re not going to be stay­ing long term, the soon­er the end, so it’s bet­ter for them. And it’s bet­ter for you as well

Brad Giles 20:30

But I think that’s the point is that how do we know if we’re look­ing at an A play­er? After a one hour interview?

Kevin Lawrence 20:38

We nev­er will. We won’t. It’s not pos­si­ble until ones that aren’t. To know from the ones that look good and seem like they’re close to tru­ly prove it out. You need you need you need more than more than an hour. In some cas­es more than a month, you need mul­ti­ple things to help you get there. And that’s why it’s called rigor.

Brad Giles 21:12

So we want to be sure. I mean, let’s just ana­lyze what we’re say­ing, Well, we know this per­son is going to be the top 10% of avail­able can­di­dates. At the pay rate that we offer after one hour, there’s just no way. Right. So we take the best that we use a good fil­ter­ing process and ref­er­ence check­ing, and a good job score­card. And then we signed a con­tract know­ing that with­in 90 days, Aster­ix get your own legal advice with­in the with­in 90 days, there’ll be an a pro­ba­tion peri­od where if they’re not a good fit, a suc­cess­ful fit, you can exit them. And then we rely on that that 90 day process to get there.

Kevin Lawrence 21:50

But I want to be clear. Ide­al­ly, we enter hir­ing with 90% suc­cess rate on pick­ing a play­ers to hire that’s the key. Right? And when you’re hir­ing peo­ple fresh out of col­lege and one of my com­pa­nies down us the hire a lot of col­lege grads, you know they can’t with col­lege grads, it’s hard because some of them are even fig­ur­ing out who they are. But the key is, the fil­ter is before the job offer. The insur­ance or the dou­ble check­ing comes with the onboard­ing, want to make sure we’re say­ing the same thing and not con­fus­ing people.

Brad Giles 22:21

Yeah, we def­i­nite­ly got we’ve got to have a good hir­ing process. There’s no doubt about it.

Kevin Lawrence 22:27

And you want to you want to max­i­mize the dis­rup­tion by not bring­ing in peo­ple who aren’t going to be A play­ers in that role to do the best job. And one more exam­ple, I’ll share a very com­mon one that I have seen. And nor­mal­ly it’s peo­ple who have pro­files I call a high are very influ­enc­ing per­son­al­i­ties. I don’t my is quite high. I don’t remem­ber how high yours is Brad. But I’m the type of per­son I can make a very good first impres­sion if I choose to. And the num­ber of peo­ple that get hired that are very charm­ing, is incred­i­ble. I remem­ber once I had a CEO, a very suc­cess­ful guy that’s going back like 15 or 20 years ago, and love the guy, real­ly enjoyed him. And I just met this woman to have to replace his EA as exec­u­tive assis­tant. She was amaz­ing. I hired her on the spot. And I’m like, but please tell me you did­n’t give her the offer? Yeah, yeah, I did. She was so good. I’m like, I’ve been involved in a lot of hir­ing of admin­is­tra­tive assis­tants, and pro­filed a lot of them over the years. And the num­ber one thing is the best ones often don’t make the best first impres­sion. Because they’re grinders, and they’re pro­tect­ing your sched­ule and orga­niz­ing things. And the ones who make amaz­ing first impres­sions, high per­cent, and many of them flamed out. So it did­n’t mean that the per­son was bad. It just means if you feel com­pelled to hire on the spot, they were incred­i­bly charm­ing. And once we get charmed, we for­get to val­i­date for skills and abil­i­ty and all those oth­er things. But in terms of this one last­ed like three weeks, but because they were all charm, they did­n’t have capa­bil­i­ty. It’s not that you can’t be charm­ing and capa­ble. But the admin­is­tra­tive assis­tant role requires a lot of rig­or, dis­ci­pline, pre­ci­sion, and charm in his par­tic­u­lar case, charm was not a charm made him feel good, but he need­ed a lot of dis­ci­pline, rig­or­ous work done. So again, there’s, it’s hard, it’s hard. But if you’re clear up front of what you’re look­ing for, you’re thor­ough in the process and you look for the pat­terns. Yeah, if you look for the pat­terns, I mean, you know, our show next week is about lev­el five lead­er­ship and and becom­ing and find­ing lev­el five lead­ers Any­one has a cou­ple of great ques­tions you can ask actu­al­ly about to help iden­ti­fy if peo­ple are true lev­el five lead­ers, even from what you can dig into. And we watch for that stuff, right? We just watch for the peo­ple that are going to come in and just either not do well in a job because they don’t fit or not do well in the cul­ture because they’re there, they’re going to be disruptive.

Brad Giles 25:21

Okay, so maybe let’s move on to some key points here. Okay, so what we’re say­ing, if we go back to the orig­i­nal ques­tion, how do we iden­ti­fy a play­er’s dur­ing an inter­view? Well, over­all, to bring peo­ple on, you’ve got to have a rig­or­ous process, right, we’re sug­gest­ing a three step process with a great role score­card, a great hir­ing process, and an effec­tive onboard­ing process. So we start with the role score­card to under­stand what suc­cess is or an A play­er actu­al­ly looks like this is before you’ve made any can­di­dates or placed a job advert then dur­ing recruit­ment inter­views dur­ing recruit­ment. Start with your score­card under­stand what suc­cess looks like. And actu­al­ly looks like then dur­ing recruit­ment inter­views have some­thing to com­pare against. Before we placed the job advert, we want to have clear under­stand­ing of suc­cess. And as Kim calls it, an engi­neer spec for the role assess­ment. So the hir­ing process ensures that the per­son is a great fit for the role. Okay, but that’s not the end. That’s our, what we get then is we believe this per­son is a poten­tial fit. There’s a 90% chance of suc­cess is what that’s say­ing. And that’s the­o­ry, some­times the­o­ry does­n’t work in real life. But that’s what we’re kind of advo­cat­ing here. Lead­ers prob­lem is that they expect per­fec­tion from the hir­ing deal. It’s like the deal is done, let’s move on. If this per­son is a good fit, they’ll work out, right. But good fit is actu­al­ly the prob­lem here. We’re not look­ing for good fit, we’re look­ing for a suc­cess­ful fit. So when we’re mak­ing the deci­sion, we’ve got to make sure that we’ve checked ref­er­ences will get the right com­pen­sa­tion that would clar­i­fy the expec­ta­tions of the role, the per­son under­stands that. And then after we’ve signed the employ­ment con­tract, we tran­si­tion to onboard­ing. And then if we believe we’ve got a poten­tial a play­er onboard­ing, should val­i­date that, okay. And after 90 days work­ing in the busi­ness, we should be real­ly con­fi­dent this per­son is going to be a star here. It tells us if the per­son out of the hir­ing process, who is a poten­tial fit becomes a suc­cess­ful fit. And now the work begins. So we’ve now got to begin to work through with the indi­vid­ual what are the under­stand­ings that per­son needs to have to become a suc­cess­ful fit the cul­tur­al under­stand­ings the man­agers under­stand­ings and the tech­ni­cal and process under­stand­ings. And then by the time 90 days, occurs, the end of the onboard­ing, we forced that deci­sion. Is this per­son a suc­cess­ful fit, or an unsuc­cess­ful fit? And then that is the man­ager’s job, not hrs job. So we got a few episodes to look through here, Episode 100. Top grad­ing high with 90% suc­cess, Episode 89, the four dif­fer­ent types of a play­er’s Episode 88, the hid­den cost of not hav­ing a team of all a play­ers and num­ber 53 What is the top grad­ing score­card? And how do you use it.

Kevin Lawrence 28:47

That’s it. That’s the show. This is not rock­et sci­ence, who said it’s dis­ci­pline and my favorite quotes from Jim Collins is no great­ness is not a func­tion of cir­cum­stance. Great­ness, it turns out is large­ly con­scious choice and dis­ci­pline. And that’s all this is decid­ing you’re gonna have a great team. So that’s top that top grad­ing and that’s the growth whis­pers for this week. Thanks for join­ing us. If you want more episodes, you can go and look for the growth whis­pers and sub­scribe and please rate us and give us a great rat­ing if you think it’s valu­able. If you’ve got ques­tions like today, please send those in. For the YouTube video go to youtube gmail​.com and search for the growth whis­pers Brad’s got a great newslet­ter and great resources on his site and you can get a hold of them at evo­lu­tion part​ners​.com​.au And for myself at Lawrence and Co our firm has we have a great newslet­ter and also resources. Lawrence and co​.com Hope you have an awe­some week and good luck find­ing the tal­ent that you want.